Unlocking Leadership: Dr. Andy Neillie's Four Cs for Success
Episode 63 Frederick Dudek (Freddy D)
Unlocking Leadership: Dr. Andy Neillie's Four Cs for Success
Dr. Andy Neillie joins us to dive into the core of effective leadership, emphasizing that true leadership is all about putting others first. With over 25 years of experience, he's a pro at transforming teams into strong, resilient units, drawing from his extensive work in both corporate environments and his own successful swim school business. We explore his philosophy that revolves around four key leadership necessities: conviction, competence, character, and covenant. These principles aren’t just buzzwords; they’re critical for cultivating an environment where team members feel valued and empowered, which ultimately leads to organizational success. With practical insights and real-world examples, Andy shows us how to navigate the challenges of leadership without losing sight of what truly matters—developing a loyal and high-performing team.
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The podcast explores the transformative journey of leadership through the lens of Dr. Andy Neillie, who articulates the critical elements that define effective leaders. Drawing from his vast experience, Neillie underscores the necessity of understanding that leadership goes beyond mere management; it's about nurturing relationships and fostering a culture of empowerment. He introduces the 'four Cs'— conviction, competence, character, and covenant— as essential attributes that leaders must cultivate to inspire their teams. Each segment of the conversation reveals practical strategies for implementing these principles in real-world scenarios. For instance, Neillie discusses how leaders can hold difficult conversations that promote growth and accountability, emphasizing that such dialogues are not merely a managerial obligation but a testament to a leader's commitment to their team's development. The episode also touches upon the often-overlooked aspect of humility in leadership, where true leaders listen and adapt to the needs of their teams, creating a supportive and collaborative environment. This deep dive into the intricacies of leadership challenges listeners to reflect on their own styles and the impact they have on their organizations.
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Takeaways:
- Dr. Andy Neillie emphasizes the significance of putting people first in leadership, which fosters resilience and teamwork, essential for thriving in business environments.
- True leadership transcends mere management; it requires a commitment to developing team competence and nurturing a positive culture that enhances employee retention.
- The four leadership necessities identified by Andy—conviction, competence, character, and covenant—are crucial for effective leadership in any business setting.
- Leaders should lean into hard conversations with their teams, recognizing that holding tough discussions is a sign of trust and competence in their leadership abilities.
- Building a culture of appreciation and recognition within a team leads to higher engagement and loyalty, as employees feel valued and understood by their leaders.
- Investing in understanding diverse cultural dynamics is essential for leaders to successfully manage global teams and adapt their leadership style accordingly.
Links referenced in this episode:
Companies mentioned in this episode:
- Neillie Leadership Group
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Transcript
Joining us today is Dr. Andy Neely, an entrepreneur, business owner and leadership coach with a passion for cultivating strong, resilient teams.
As the founder of Neely Leadership Group, he has more than 5 million frequent flyer miles from working with clients across the globe to develop their teams. Additionally, during the past 15 years, Dr.
Andy has built a multi million dollar, multi unit swim school business, providing over 200,000 swim lessons annually. His leadership philosophy blends practical wisdom with a focus on humility, resilience.
Drawing from more than 25 years of experience and research, Dr.
Andy champions the idea that true leadership is about putting others first, navigating challenges with optimism, and making small but impactful decisions that build success. Whether mentoring staff, overseeing growth, or navigating the risks of business expansion, Dr.
Andy consistently emphasizes the importance teamwork and staying grounded in core values beyond business.
Andy is a fitness enthusiast and pet owner, often finding leadership lessons in unexpected places, whether in the gym, managing a business, or observing the habits of the many dogs he and his family have rescued over the years. His ability to weave relatable everyday experiences into powerful leadership insights makes Neely a sought after speaker and mentor.
Freddy D:Welcome Andy from the Neely Leadership Group all the way from the Chicago burbs. Welcome to the Business Superfans podcast. How are you, Andy?
Dr. Andy Neillie:Good. And I gotta clarify, you and I share some Chicago roots. You got down to Scottsdale, I'm now in Austin, so those roots go deep.
But neither one of us are dealing with Chicago politics or winters anymore.
Freddy D:No, I started off actually in Hanover park and then from Hanover I worked in Schaumburg, but I moved to, from, to Addison, then from Addison, I moved to Hoffman Estates, then Barrington, Lake Shores, then down to Lincoln park. And I kicked myself in a butt for not moving down into Lincoln park in the first place.
Dr. Andy Neillie:I was a youth and we were on the south side. My dad was in the steel industry and we were. He was in some of the businesses that supported the Hammond, Indiana, Gary, Indiana area.
So it sounds like both of us were happy to get out of there. I told my wife at one point I lived in kind of a rough suburban neighborhood and she never believed me.
I moved to Phoenix when I was in high school, met my wife in Arizona, where you're at, and took her and our young daughter back for a family wedding over in Naperville on the Northwest side.
Freddy D:I know where that's at.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah, we drove down to my old neighborhood. And this will not surprise you at all, Freddie, because we both know Chicago pulled up in front of our old house.
Somebody Walked out of the house, young guy. I rolled down the window and said, hey, I grew up in that house. What's it like to live here?
He pulled a gun out, Freddie and said, it's okay if you can shoot. And then to my wife, and I said, do you finally believe me, honey? And I rolled the window up and we left.
Freddy D:Bye, bye.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Bye, bye. That's right.
Freddy D:Crazy.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Today we're in Austin and loving it, and. And although we had a little bit of dusting of snow, you're recording with me on our one snow day a year, and that was this morning.
About an eighth of an inch was gone.
Freddy D:Yeah. My daughter's down in Houston. She's doing speech pathology down there.
Dr. Andy Neillie:So for a little while.
Freddy D:So, Andy, tell me how. What's your story? And how did you come up with the leadership group?
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, I've spent some time listening to some of your guests. You got some really wicked smart people that you've interacted with. I wish I could say it was strategic and purposeful and planning.
Here's what I know. Early on. In fact, it wasn't even early on in my career, Freddie.
It was when I was working construction in the Valley of the sun to work my way through college. I just had some bad bosses. I remember one of my bosses, he just had an anger management issue, and he took it out on the guys on the crew.
I was one of the guys on the crew. And if he was mad, you better not be around him when he's got a power tool in his hand. My faith became important to me at a very young age.
I'm a Christian, and I'm reading the biographies of great servant leader. And then I'm working for this guy that's got anger management issues. And I'm just realizing this isn't the way it's supposed to be.
And Freddy, more than 25 years ago now, it just kind of awakened in me a passion around. Nobody's supposed to work for a bad boss. What makes somebody a good boss?
And really, that's been my journey for 5 million frequent flyer miles over the last 25 years, circling the globe, working with leadership teams in technology and finance and doing workshops and training and some keynotes and coaching and working with some of the best leadership teams for small businesses and Fortune 500. And just realizing leadership is different than management. It's not in opposition to management, but it's different than management.
And you pretty much have to decide to become a good leader. It doesn't happen naturally.
Freddy D:No, I totally agree.
,: He showed up at about:We're in the office and we had some money came in, says four of us working, prepping for the demo next day because we're selling technology so we got to make sure we're demoing their product and how our stuff addresses it. So we had pizzas, we had some beers.
He goes, all right guys, I know you guys are going to stay late, but don't stay late and I'll see you guys in the morning and knock it out. And so we did, we worked late, we basically did.
Pulled an all nighter, got dressed in the morning and we killed the presentation because we were really prepared, fired up, you know, and the energy. So when you're fired up, the energy's rolling mid afternoon. He goes, right, man, guys did a great job. It's Thursday. I'll see you guys Monday.
Get the heck out of here. That was it. We were gone. We still remember that. And I'm still friends with one of the guys that we worked with on that project.
We still talk about that manager because he empowered us. He not only. He recognized us and empowered us well.
Dr. Andy Neillie:And you and I talked before you turned the recorder on. I've tried to boil it down to what I call the four leadership necessities. And you just touched on one of them.
One of the four leadership necessities is this whole area of competence. Am I giving my people what they need to execute well?
And, and I guarantee if we went deeper into your story, he didn't just show up with pizza and beer. He'd been showing up for a long time making sure you had what you need to be successful.
So he had the confidence in you that he knew you were going to do a good job. There's a difference between delegation and abdication. And this guy delegated responsibility to you because he knew you were going to do a good job.
That's that area of if I'm a good leader, I'm making my people More and more competent underneath me, I'm giving them the tools they need to execute.
Freddy D:Oh, absolutely. My perception on a good leader is really you work for your team, not the other way around. It's not your team works for you.
You work for your team to make them successful. And your team will make you successful as a leader.
Dr. Andy Neillie: the problem with that. In the:Freddie, you and I get it that real leaders are at the bottom of the pyramid. They're not at the top of the pyramid. The whole goal of a good leader is nobody knows that you're pulling the strings and hitting the buttons.
It's other people that are doing it.
So I think part of the reason why my voice resident in the market some is people can't define it as well as you and I can because we've thought about it a lot.
But people can kind there's a scent in the wind when they're around a good leader and when they're around somebody that's not a good leader and they know celebrity influence is not leadership, it's self aggrandizement. If you would. So I think you and I will always have a voice because followers and emerging leaders don't want to work for that kind of person.
They want to support somebody that recognizes they're at the bottom of the pyramid.
Freddy D:Well, yeah, absolutely correct. Because one of my quotes in my book Andy is people will crawl through broken glass for appreciation and recognition.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, and Patrick Lencioni said in one of his recent books, yes, anybody will appreciate a raise. But real reason people stay is because of the environment that's built around them. And that's leadership. Right.
Culture and vision are tied to leadership. So the man that brought pizza and beer, he didn't just show up, he'd been showing up for a while.
And that's why you felt good about his leadership and it was the right thing for him to give you Friday off because he knew how hard you'd work.
Freddy D:Yeah, I was the team. So go on. Let's talk about more about your leadership. You mentioned there's four, so we talked about one. Let's. What are the other three?
Dr. Andy Neillie:So that's the second one and it's the area of competence. The four leadership necessities are conviction. Competence, character and covenant. Conviction. The whole passion. You see the bigger picture.
Leaders, particularly you and I, work some with entrepreneurs and emerging businesses. And as somebody Goes from being a solopreneur to having a team. Part of what they've got to do is realize I need to get my eyes up now.
I need to not just be looking on the project, but I need to be looking three months out. And I need to begin to understand the competitive landscape. And I've got to have a sense of the development path in front of us.
They've got to see bigger, they've got to see broader, they've got to see further. That's the conviction piece. You and I might call it passion or vision. I found four Cs to make it somewhat memorable. But the first leadership.
And really, I would say the thing that defines a leader going in is are they somebody that sees the bigger picture? We already talked about the competence piece. The third piece again, you and I could talk for a long time about character.
You and I both, unfortunately can tell some bad stories. Probably because we've been around.
Stephen Covey said In his book 7 Habits more than 30 years ago, people join organizations because of the job, they leave because of their boss.
Freddy D:Absolutely correct.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Are you other oriented? Are you self sacrificing? Are you honest?
These character traits, in some respects, if vision is what opens the door to leadership, character is what leaves a lasting legacy in leadership. You'll never be a better leader than you are a person. And then the last one, Freddie, I struggled with identifying what I was seeing it.
If you go back and listen to some of my old stuff from five years ago, I was calling it consistency because that was another C word. For a while I called it alignment, communication, consistent communication. And then I realized what it is.
It's really a reflection of the word covenant. Now, covenant is kind of an old fashioned word.
Although Guy Ritchie did a pretty good movie, a pretty brutal Guy Ritchie movie about three years ago called Covenant. There's a beautiful movie. Here's what a covenant is.
I live in the state of Texas today and when a couple wants to get married, obviously there's a romantic love and affection and sickness and in health and richness and in poorness, forever and ever, amen. The whole, you know, we love each other, we're giddy about it.
What people fail to realize if you get married in the state of Texas, there's also a formal document that's signed by a legal officiant and recorded with the county clerk. There is both a personal side and a formal side. When I realized that's what I see good leaders do. They drive to execute on the project.
They're in charge of a team that's got to deliver a certain sales quota or finish up an agile sprint on some software code or whatever it is, they're in charge, they're driven to fulfill the formal obligation of their leadership responsibility.
And then Freddie, you find out, and that boss just gave her an extra three weeks off that went beyond the HR policy for PTO because her spouse is struggling with cancer right now. And it was just the right thing to do and they made it happen. It was a personal investment because that was the right thing to do.
And finally I realized that's what I'm seeing in these people that are merging as high performing leaders. They manage the tension of firm expectations and performance criteria with the personal side of leading.
Well, covenant is probably the word that captures that. So conviction, competence, character and covenant, in my mind, nothing new under leadership since Jesus and Marcus Aurelius.
If you're working on those four areas, Freddie, at some level you can say, I'm not just a manager, I'm working to become a high performing leader.
Freddy D:No, absolutely, because you bring up a great point there. My wife and I, we just got married in October of last year. Thank you. We've been together 12 years now.
Actually, a few days ago we had planned on going on a long honeymoon. I've been talking to her about Australia since I met her.
So we planned a pretty big trip and then we went back to the company and they said, whoa, that's a big request. Because we were going for six weeks and she'd been with the company seven years in April.
And so they worked with us and came up with a creative way to where? Okay, we were in Hawaii for a week, so she worked that week, but they said, okay, you can work early leverage time zones.
Then we had to cut back one week.
We had to give up a week of our trip, but we ended up with five weeks and they paid for four weeks of her to be out on a trip because she's also one of the top performers in the company. So she goes above and beyond, but more importantly, she's not making the level of money that she could someplace else.
But like we were talking earlier, she's got a culture and people appreciate what she contributes to the company. So they figured out a way to make sure she was covered and more importantly paid for it.
And they still gave her an extra buffer, which worked out because she ended up getting sick at the end, so it didn't screw up the trip. So she had three days sick and they had it all planned. So they were thinking ahead.
Okay, you're gone for five weeks, the odds of getting sick are pretty high, especially on a cruise ship and everything else.
Dr. Andy Neillie:And here's the wonderful thing that happens, and your wife is probably a testimonial to that. When a leader leads with covenant, we create loyalty. Right.
Because you said a minute ago, she could probably go somewhere else and make some more money, but she's invested in that culture. So these four characteristics that really begin to define high performance leadership. People come and they stay. Right?
Because they might not be able to articulate exactly why. They just know this is a good place for me to work, that's a good boss, this is a good leadership team.
Freddy D:And that's, that's where it begins by creating superfans.
Because if you get a great leadership team, then a great leader, then you've empowered a team that is energized, positive, and that transcends to prospective customers, existing customers, suppliers, distributors, complementary businesses that energy carries and comes across. People don't realize it, but energy is very important because you got someone that's upset about their job, unhappy. Yeah, Andy, how can we help you?
And you're going to go, geez, do I really want to deal with that.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Company you talk about in your tx Total experience, the vendor, supplier side of things. Even those people, how do they choose? Do I show up at your plant and do the repair, or do I show up at that other plant and do the repair?
Freddy D:Bingo. Right there.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Freddie has dealt with me better for the last 18 months than that company has. So I got to make a decision. I'm going to Freddie's plant. That's leadership, even for vendors that you're hiring to do a project for you.
So I appreciate your insight that leadership can't be turned off and on. If you're growing as a real leader, everybody wins.
Freddy D:That's right. Everybody's got to win.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah.
Freddy D:Because now those like you just used the example, Andy.
They're going to get some favoritism, but at the same time, they're going to tell other people, those suppliers, oh, you're looking to deal with that company, man. Andy's a super guy. You're going to love working with him. And people go, wow, okay, cool. We're going to go with that guy.
Dr. Andy Neillie:You know, if we're being real honest, part of the challenge at times is that ends up being expensive. Right. I'm sure you could tell stories. I can tell. I've got painful stories that I've had to share with my wife.
As a small business owner, my wife and I are multi Unit business owners, retail business owners here in Central Texas, in addition to my leadership speaking and training and coaching. And I've kept people on because I wanted to be the best leader I could be. And they took advantage of us.
And at the end of the day, our profitability of this small business, it meant the money I brought home for our household was minimized because that person took advantage of the company. That was my company that I owned. So leadership is expensive. It's not celebrity influencers getting all the glory on them.
It's down and dirty and grindy and ugly and ultimately there is a long term payoff. But leadership, this type of leadership you and I are talking about at times is expensive.
That opening illustration you shared of the guy that brought pizza and beer, there's a chance that was a company contribution.
There was also a chance that he just pulled out his own debit card at the local pizza joint and bought the beer and pizza out of his pocket because he knew it was the right thing to do.
Freddy D:Totally agree.
So, Andy, share a story of how you've walked into a company that was in disarray and you implemented your four Cs and transformed that company to where now they're your superfans and telling other people about what you did for them.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah, I knew you were going to ask me about that. That's the focus of your show building super fans. You know, part of the challenge with leadership development is they call it a soft skill.
I hate that term soft skill because in some respects anybody can figure out how to build a spreadsheet. Leadership is hard. What they call soft skills are some of the hardest skills possible.
And in some respects it's hard to document success when you've been successful. Here's what I do know. I've tried to invest these four leadership necessities into my team for the last 15 years. I am a multi unit franchise.
I would be one. Freddie. But:I had a friend from the Valley, the Sun, who'd taken his backyard swim lessons and turned him into a franchise model. Fifteen years later, my wife and I own a $5 million business here in Central Texas.
We're multi unit franchisees of the largest network of swim schools in the world. And I've got 175 people to work for me. I've got seven managers who are retail managers working in a retail environment, hourly workers.
And I've got a couple of them that have been with me for more than a dozen years. They come and they stay. When you look at their resume, they didn't even have a resume.
But when you look at the work they did prior to coming to our environment and every six months they were at a different convenience store, Walmart, photo booth or retailer, retail people don't stay. That's part of their life is they typically move around. And I've got some people that have been with me since almost the very beginning.
So I know these principles work. They're deeply embedded.
When Cisco 20 years ago was the highest stock price, Cisco, the most valuable company in the world, we were embedding a whole bunch of coaching, leadership coaching, training inside. And they would say part of the reason our sales teams are having such incredible success is because of the developmental coaching that's being done.
So the proof is in the pudding. It's just harder to measure because it's soft skills. It's not really soft skills.
Employee retention, customer satisfaction, NPS scores, they all climb. When leadership culture is healthy. And that's what I've been doing for 25 years, 15 years into my own.
Freddy D:Organization, along with income, profit scaling, all those components come into play. I just recently helped a interpreting and translation company and I'm not going to go into all the details, but they had some challenges.
They had people quitting every 90 days and. Yep. And re onboarding and then quitting and repeating. Shorten this whole story.
I took over the company and one of the first things I did was we started weekly meetings and everybody knew where our target was. Everybody thought I was nuts because I set a super high goal, I mean like really high for that company in that market space.
But every Monday morning we got together. This was the goal. What were the issues, what was not happening.
And everybody started to get into the same robo when like that in Lincoln park in Chicago where they're doing the roaring races. You got the four people in the boat and everybody's got to be in synchronization otherwise you're not going to anywhere really fast.
We started to see some changes and then we hit some milestones and so we started celebrating and we started bringing in pizzas in for lunch and we're celebrating a success. It really started to get everybody going and we grew that business by a million dollars in a year and position it for acquisition.
It's been acquired since then, so I totally understand what you're talking about. I think a lot of leaders don't do share revenue goals. It's a secret how much money we're making. It's a secret to what our goals are.
No, I share the bottom line with people. Hey, we're negative net income. This is what we got to do. So I don't want to lose anybody. What can we do to change that?
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah, well, and the interesting thing is, if you told me 15 years ago I'd be having these same discussions with $17 an hour retail workers that I've had at Cisco with $350,000 sales execs. But you're right, they get it.
When I go into one of my well functioning retail establishments, the front desk, people who are high school and college age, they have a whiteboard behind the desk showing them what their enrollment goals are, what their revenue goals are for the month and where they are today. My managers do that well when I've got healthy managers and so everybody gets on board. You're exactly right.
People want to know they're making a difference. Right.
Freddy D:That's really it. Because if everybody knows one what the goal is, you have a much better chance of hitting that goal when everybody's part of it.
However, some don't care.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Jim Collins in his book Good to Great said, get the right people on the bus, get the wrong people off the bus. That's what you and I are talking about.
Because the truth matter is there are some people that show up into that environment and they don't want to be held that accountable. They don't want to show up for their shift and know that hey, we've our goal for the rest of the day is this much.
In retail sales, they don't really care if you're building the kind of culture that is a high performing culture. Those people just aren't going to stay around long.
They're either going to self select out or you and the rest of your team is going to say they're not in that boat rowing the same direction as the rest of us.
Freddy D:And they're actually polluting the team because you've got one person starting to do negative talk and all that stuff and.
Dr. Andy Neillie:It spreads all in the other direction. Exactly. So these four leadership necessities, Freddie, I didn't really create them.
I tried to capture a simple model of what I was observing top performers doing. People that were not just managers, people that other people were saying, man, I'm glad to follow that gal, I'm happy to follow that guy.
I just tried to put some language around it.
new in leadership in the last:And so for a certain mindset of small business owners and divisional leaders inside companies that I've worked with, the four leadership necessities becomes an easy, I guess an easy taxonomy. You come out of a computer world. You guys have computer languages.
This would be an easy taxonomy of leadership, conviction, competence, character and covenant. You get those right, you're probably becoming a high performing leader.
Freddy D:Oh, absolutely. And you've got a team behind you because there's a video and you may have seen it, it's on YouTube.
There's a guy that's dancing on the hill at a concert and everybody thinks he's nuts. He's by himself, he's dancing away, and everybody's just looking at him sitting on blankets.
It's pretty impressive video because it teaches you about leadership. He's by himself. Finally he gets a second guy that comes along and now there's two of them dancing away like a bunch of bozos.
And then two more guys come along and now there's four. All of a sudden you see two more six. And then all of a sudden it goes to 12. And then all of a sudden it goes to 24.
And next thing you know, everybody, even the people that were on the ground, you can see in the videos that were under blankets, are getting up and going in. Cause that's where the party's at. That's where the action is at. And that's where the fun and it all because one leader stepped out and stood out.
Dr. Andy Neillie:I agree. You gotta be willing to be the unicorn or the distinctive one or the outlander. And that's part of that conviction piece, right?
I hear music that I think we should be dancing to. I'm not gonna look around seeing for somebody else to start dancing. I'm gonna start dancing. That's that leadership, conviction.
The one thing I think I always wanna mitigate when I'm talking about leadership, conviction. Freddie, you and I have worked for some people we know some people. You might be one of these. They just wake up full of passion.
They're just got a spring in their step from the second they get out of bed. People would call them people of passion and conviction. And most of the people I work with, at times I almost feel guilty. Well, I'm not that guy.
I don't see things other people don't see. I'm not taking the latest hill.
I think One of the things I've seen from effective leaders is they don't have to be people of great success, conviction at first. But if they put their hand to the plow and apply diligence and energy, they start to believe in things. And that belief in things is infectious.
Freddy D:Absolutely.
Dr. Andy Neillie:That conviction grows over time when you're invested in something.
So for your listeners, that saying, Andy, that doesn't fit for me because I'm just not a passionate person and I, I hear them, I, I don't think people would consider me a passionate person either.
But man, when you do something and you really are invested in it, as long as it's a worthy cause and you feel good about the impact it's having on the world around you, conviction grows, Passion grows. I never intended to work here for 25 years, but I liked the place. That's not a bad leadership story. That's not a bad leadership story. No.
Freddy D:And if you want to take that further, I, I played on a global stage that brought on a bunch of independent, what we used to call value added resellers, you know, distributors. So now you've got cultural things that you got to deal with.
An independent distributor can represent whatever products they want because they don't work for you, they're independent. And then how do you get mind share of those people to sell portion of your product?
So, you know, that takes a leadership that takes a special skill set to really one, deal with cultural differences and more importantly, motivate those people. And it's really not those people, it's their teams because you got to motivate their team to want to represent and market your product.
So that takes what you're just saying. The four Cs come into play in a bigger aspect on a global stage.
Dr. Andy Neillie:That. Right?
And recognizing conviction ends up looking different in a Japanese culture than it does in a Scottish culture, than it does in a Brazilian culture, than it does, my goodness, even here in the States. You and I've laughed a little bit about being from Chicago.
People from New York react differently than people from Chicago, react differently than people from Scottsdale, who react differently than people from Boise, Idaho. And if you and I are going to be sensitive to that, we still employ these four Cs, but we employ them differently.
And man, the first time I was working with a primarily Indian sales team, I just had to recognize that, man, my North American bent is not working here. I need to be the one that adjusts.
They still need to learn and they still need to grow and they still need to perform but the way I dial those levers is different than when I'm working with some folks from Central Texas.
Freddy D:Oh yeah.
When I was in charge of global sales for a CAM product, a computer manufacturing product, I went to Tokyo, Japan for a couple of trade shows and we had a master that was very interested in our technology because they would have got all of Jap land and, and they would be getting sub distributors underneath them.
So attended a trade show, did the presentation, did the contract, all that stuff, crickets, nothing happening, talked to them, went back again for another show and et cetera. So I'm in Australia having dinner with one of my distributors in Australia. I'm going, hey, Paul was his first name, and go, what am I doing wrong?
He goes, well, what are you talking about? I says, well, we talk about the contract, the market capabilities, the product scalability and all that kind of stuff.
He goes, what the heck yapping about that stuff. Start investing relationship and learning about them. What I'm talking about business. So I went back, tell me, where should I go visit.
I want to be a tourist. And next thing you know, they took me out, they showed me places, they took me out to dinner and went to one of those geisha restaurants.
You have to take your shoes off and sit on the floor. I mean, it was phenomenal experience.
And when they came back here to visit us, we had a two hour meeting in Scottsdale and then I took them and drove them all the way around the valley so they could actually see and experience Phoenix. They went back, didn't hear anything.
Month And a half, two months later, I got a purchase order for 200,000, signed contract and they were ready to go.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, and in some respects, Freddie, I know we're going to be wrapping up our podcast in the next few minutes, but in some respects you just demonstrated that third leadership element, character, because you are humble enough to say, I got to learn more about them, I'm not just going to make them learn about me. And that's, you know, a lot of my work has been with sales teams because needing to understand the way you add value is getting in their shoes.
I'm smiling and nodding at you as you tell that story because you and I both know you can get zero feedback from a Japanese audience, but that doesn't mean they're not fully engaged.
And the fact that you got that PO later doesn't surprise me at all because you were humble enough to say, I need to meet you where you're at, rather than expecting you to meet me where I'm At. And that's a reflection of leadership character.
Freddy D:And asking for help.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah, exactly.
Freddy D:Because the other thing is asking for help. Sometimes you kind of put yourself aside and say, hey, I'm stuck, I need some help, I need someone else to give me some advice.
And that's where your services come in, is to leaders that says, okay, what are we doing wrong? We're stuck. We don't know what to do to punch through to the next level.
That's where you come in with those type of business opportunities to say, okay, let's take a look from an outside perspective like Paul did. He listened to what I was doing and he just basically for him was clear as day. You're yapping about the wrong stuff.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Exactly.
Freddy D:So, you know, same thing with you. You come in and it'll take you minutes.
You can say, okay, I see this, I can see this, I can see that, and okay, we need to make some tweaks and some adjustments and boom, we'll get you flowing.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, a lot of what I do when I initially get involved with clients is I give them a leadership self assessment so that they can see themselves.
What, how do I view myself in these areas that Andy talks about alignment and execution and strategy and what am I doing well and what could I be doing better and kind of hold up the mirror to them and help them see leadership is different than pop psychology and social media would make it look like it's been slower and harder and less visible than we think it is at times.
Freddy D:Okay, you're absolutely correct. So I know we're got a few more minutes here.
Can you give me a couple of actionable takeaways that leaders can utilize to look at themselves and their leadership skills and then if they're not achieving what the outcome is, you're the guy to reach out to.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, I hope I'm the guy for some of them to reach out to because I really believe, I think you can tell I'm pretty passionate about no bad bosses. One of the defining characteristics of a leader is managers get the easy conversations, leaders get the hard conversations.
If you're being asked to hold hard conversations, take that as a compliment. That means people look to you. They may not be able to articulate it, but this is a person of competence and character that I trust.
So I would say one of the characteristics that would tell you if you're becoming a high performing leader or not is do you know how to hold a hard conversation? That doesn't necessarily mean it's a harsh conversation, but it's a Hard conversation.
Can you sit down with one of your team members and make eye contact and talk about a performance review that isn't where it needs to be, or deadlines that were missed? And at the end of that conversation, have them and you know, they may need to lick their wounds a little bit, but have them.
And you both know this was a conversation that needs to take place. Leaders. Managers get the easy conversations. Leaders get the hard conversations.
So you want to know if you're a leader, lean into the hard conversations. You'll make mistakes along the way. I think the other thing you and I would agree with one another is we never get this right. It's a dynamic tension.
You never arrive as a leader. You're always working on it. But I think one of the defining characteristics is leaders.
Are you leaning into the hard conversations with your teams, with your vendors, with your customers and clientele? If you're doing that, you're demonstrating some.
Freddy D:Leadership chops, and that will most likely result in some super fans. Because sometimes people will need that, have to have that conversation, and all of a sudden they'll have time to reflect and go, you know what?
I needed that. I needed that.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Talk to me that way. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah.
Freddy D:So, Andy, how can people find you?
Dr. Andy Neillie:Well, Neely Leadership N E I L I E. Leadership.com is my website. I've got a bunch of resources there, and if somebody wants to reach out, I've got a link at the top of my website.
We can jump on a quick zoom call and visit about what they're trying to accomplish. You and I also talked about. I've got a little ebook called the Three Imperative Leadership Conversations. How to hold a Heart Conversation.
How to have a Developmental Coaching Conversation. How to Engage in the Threefold Affirmation Conversation.
Every leader needs to recognize their job is to be that enabler, that encourager that you talked about 20 minutes ago.
So it's a little ebook with some definitions, some best practices, some worksheet templates, and they can get that ebook@leadershipmaterials.com, very simple and straightforward. Just leadershipmaterials.com and so there's a couple of resources that I'd love to make available to leaders and emerging leaders.
Freddy D:Yeah, we'll put that in the show notes to make it easy for people also to be able to get. So I appreciate your time. Great conversation on the show. I'm sure we could. We probably could talk for several hours on this stuff, I think so.
Dr. Andy Neillie:I have a sense that while I may have articulated this for leadership necessities. I got somebody who's been thinking about how to lead teams well for a long time. So maybe we do this again a few months from now.
Freddy D:Oh, definitely. Definitely. We'd love to have you on the show down the road.
This is a conversation needs to be talked about, because there's a lot of upcoming leaders, and if we can influence upcoming leaders to go down the right path and shortcut so they don't have to make all the mistakes, then we've done our job.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Yeah, exactly. Right. Well, my pleasure, Freddie. Doing a good job.
I've enjoyed some of the podcasts of yours that I've been able to listen to, and thanks for the honor of having me on with your listeners.
Freddy D:It was a pleasure, Andy. Thanks.
Dr. Andy Neillie:Take care. Okay.
